new fandom + the quincy key
Mar. 18th, 2006 08:41 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
retro_eidasJust when I can't possibly be barraged with yet another fandom... another comes along of course. Within a few months, "Firefly" infected me like the plague. Then SGA came along. The newest edition to obsessive-compulsive speculating insanity? Bleach. For the non-otaku and/or minus a DLing fetish, you might not be familiar with this slice of fanon and thus this entry will mean absolutely nothing. However, it's the current hot item in anime... and my soul is all but it's bitch at the moment.
Also special thanks to new friends![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
_debbiechan_ and mrs_urahara that propagate the :cough:hot Quincy:cough: speculating madness. Since I can't seem to join a fandom without being able to nerdily speculate about it ad infinitum, I'm not sure these poor folks realize what they've gotten themselves into. If either of you bother to read this, I apologize. A lot of it will be retread from bits of our "Significant Filler" discussion over at ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
soul_society.
"The person who will protect this era... A Quincy is this key person." (not verbatim)
Oh the ridiculous amount of questions that statement has made for me... but it makes the sad, sad fangirl tingly in more naughty parts than I'd care to admit.
What exactly did Yoshino mean by a Quincy being "the key to save this era"? How do the Bound know this piece of information? Sounds like the makings of an impending prophecy reveal to me. Ishida part of some massive Bound prophecy... or just a prophecy in general? Something not necessarily limited to the Bound? Ryuuken? Souken? The Quincy (at least prior their genocide)? Perhaps more importantly (and scarily), the Shinigami?
Entirely hypotheticaly speaking... if the (or some... I'd say, Aizen and probably some or all of deceased Central 46) of the Shinigami are aware of this speculated prophecy regarding the Quincy and if the nature of the prophecy were threatening/apocalyptic/universe-altering/etc etc enough... What kind of precautions might they have taken? We already know now what they're capable of regarding those damn obstinate Quincy, so stubborn and proud to the point of imbalancing and threatening the end of the world they had to be permanently removed from the equation (or so we're told)... could they be capable of much more? Taking a look at Aizen, Gin and Mayuri... or hell, even those with 'good' intentions as Tousen, Yamamoto, Hinamori, Urahara and Byakuya... I'm truthfully afraid of the full extent of things they're capable of (whether it's willfully or unintentionally... by duty, honor, curiosity, misplaced justice or manipulation). Whatever their intentions. Who watches the Watchmen, indeed.
Was Mayuri purely satisfying his own insatiably sick curiousity regarding all his (apparently, mass amounts of) Quincy experiments? Or was there something more to it than that? Was he also going by orders? Orders from whom?
Was the Quincy Extermination of 200 years ago really unavoidable? Furthermore, if the extermination was such a "hard" decision as Rukia was told (via Urahara presumedly)... why or how did Mayuri get access to desecrate so many (I believe the number ranged around 1600+) Quincy for the sake of his experiments? Was he just that sly he could abscond with that many souls and go unnoticed? He doesn't seem to take much tact in keeping the Quincy experiments a secret if they're supposed to be secret (hell, he apparently carried around a memento on his person of at least one of the his favorite test subjects... Uryuu's grandfather/sensei, Souken) and he was talking about said experiments openly in Soul Society. Cpt. Kyouraku's departing comments to him in ep71 would also make me lean towards Mayuri's hobbies not necessarily secrets (and what does Kyouraku and possibly the other Shinigami know exactly about those hobbies?). I do unfortunately find it hard to believe the Shinigami didn't have some general idea what was happening to those Quincy. If Ryuuken has any kind of fuel in reigniting Uryuu's hatred of the Death Gods, this probably would be his coup de grace.
In regards to the above paragraph... one could speculate every action Ryuuken has taken was in part of some greater purpose, one that he believes (as did Souken?) is destined for Uryuu.
What exactly did Urahara do that was so bad that led to his exile from Soul Society? Particularly considering some of Mengele-taicho's hobbies (and he isn't only still partaking in said hobbies, but is the current 12th Division Captain. The frickin' promoted him. Jesus). What did he do that was so much worse than what Mayuri has done/is doing? Sure the Hogyoku could be bad enough. However... I do wonder if Mayuri has friends in very high places. He may not have ascended intoHellHeaven a la Aizen, but another compadre perhaps?
I'm also wondering if Urahara's exile was so involuntary as it sounds. The word "exile" tends to exclaim 'involuntary', of course and I don't doubt it was completely serious and all forcible on the part of Shinigami's ruling body ... but I can't help but wonder just a little 'self-imposed' might factor in as well? Ditto Tessai (who I'd bet anything was Urahara's koutaicho), Yoriuchi and Isshin. I mean to say, Urahara might not have completely regretted leaving. Urahara, possibly Tessai, Yoriuchi and Isshin... all were in *high* positions of power. Until they were just... not anymore. Could it be they may have learned some very dirty and very ugly secrets about SS and wanted to leave (in utter moral disagreement and possibly in fear of their lives. Loose lips sinkhellheaven-bound ships, after all)? Yoruichi took it all a step further and was apparently all but *dead* to the Shinigami for a CENTURY. Since I don't follow the manga as closely as I probably should... I'd guess Isshin also possibly faked his death (my guess? Kenpachi believes he'd killed him. Isshin just screams former 11th Division taicho to me).
And on an entirely unrelated venue... what the hell is Cpt. Komamura? Unfortunate recipient of a high level demon spell gone bad? Youkai? Possibly more likely, a hanyou (he seems to have a similar sort of shame/angst as young Inuyasha did. Consequence of a taboo youkai/human union... and made to feel that way most of his life, up until meeting Commander Yamamoto and Tousen)?
Also special thanks to new friends
_debbiechan_ and mrs_urahara that propagate the :cough:hot Quincy:cough: speculating madness. Since I can't seem to join a fandom without being able to nerdily speculate about it ad infinitum, I'm not sure these poor folks realize what they've gotten themselves into. If either of you bother to read this, I apologize. A lot of it will be retread from bits of our "Significant Filler" discussion over at soul_society.Oh the ridiculous amount of questions that statement has made for me... but it makes the sad, sad fangirl tingly in more naughty parts than I'd care to admit.
What exactly did Yoshino mean by a Quincy being "the key to save this era"? How do the Bound know this piece of information? Sounds like the makings of an impending prophecy reveal to me. Ishida part of some massive Bound prophecy... or just a prophecy in general? Something not necessarily limited to the Bound? Ryuuken? Souken? The Quincy (at least prior their genocide)? Perhaps more importantly (and scarily), the Shinigami?
Entirely hypotheticaly speaking... if the (or some... I'd say, Aizen and probably some or all of deceased Central 46) of the Shinigami are aware of this speculated prophecy regarding the Quincy and if the nature of the prophecy were threatening/apocalyptic/universe-altering/etc etc enough... What kind of precautions might they have taken? We already know now what they're capable of regarding those damn obstinate Quincy, so stubborn and proud to the point of imbalancing and threatening the end of the world they had to be permanently removed from the equation (or so we're told)... could they be capable of much more? Taking a look at Aizen, Gin and Mayuri... or hell, even those with 'good' intentions as Tousen, Yamamoto, Hinamori, Urahara and Byakuya... I'm truthfully afraid of the full extent of things they're capable of (whether it's willfully or unintentionally... by duty, honor, curiosity, misplaced justice or manipulation). Whatever their intentions. Who watches the Watchmen, indeed.
Was Mayuri purely satisfying his own insatiably sick curiousity regarding all his (apparently, mass amounts of) Quincy experiments? Or was there something more to it than that? Was he also going by orders? Orders from whom?
Was the Quincy Extermination of 200 years ago really unavoidable? Furthermore, if the extermination was such a "hard" decision as Rukia was told (via Urahara presumedly)... why or how did Mayuri get access to desecrate so many (I believe the number ranged around 1600+) Quincy for the sake of his experiments? Was he just that sly he could abscond with that many souls and go unnoticed? He doesn't seem to take much tact in keeping the Quincy experiments a secret if they're supposed to be secret (hell, he apparently carried around a memento on his person of at least one of the his favorite test subjects... Uryuu's grandfather/sensei, Souken) and he was talking about said experiments openly in Soul Society. Cpt. Kyouraku's departing comments to him in ep71 would also make me lean towards Mayuri's hobbies not necessarily secrets (and what does Kyouraku and possibly the other Shinigami know exactly about those hobbies?). I do unfortunately find it hard to believe the Shinigami didn't have some general idea what was happening to those Quincy. If Ryuuken has any kind of fuel in reigniting Uryuu's hatred of the Death Gods, this probably would be his coup de grace.
In regards to the above paragraph... one could speculate every action Ryuuken has taken was in part of some greater purpose, one that he believes (as did Souken?) is destined for Uryuu.
What exactly did Urahara do that was so bad that led to his exile from Soul Society? Particularly considering some of Mengele-taicho's hobbies (and he isn't only still partaking in said hobbies, but is the current 12th Division Captain. The frickin' promoted him. Jesus). What did he do that was so much worse than what Mayuri has done/is doing? Sure the Hogyoku could be bad enough. However... I do wonder if Mayuri has friends in very high places. He may not have ascended into
I'm also wondering if Urahara's exile was so involuntary as it sounds. The word "exile" tends to exclaim 'involuntary', of course and I don't doubt it was completely serious and all forcible on the part of Shinigami's ruling body ... but I can't help but wonder just a little 'self-imposed' might factor in as well? Ditto Tessai (who I'd bet anything was Urahara's koutaicho), Yoriuchi and Isshin. I mean to say, Urahara might not have completely regretted leaving. Urahara, possibly Tessai, Yoriuchi and Isshin... all were in *high* positions of power. Until they were just... not anymore. Could it be they may have learned some very dirty and very ugly secrets about SS and wanted to leave (in utter moral disagreement and possibly in fear of their lives. Loose lips sink
And on an entirely unrelated venue... what the hell is Cpt. Komamura? Unfortunate recipient of a high level demon spell gone bad? Youkai? Possibly more likely, a hanyou (he seems to have a similar sort of shame/angst as young Inuyasha did. Consequence of a taboo youkai/human union... and made to feel that way most of his life, up until meeting Commander Yamamoto and Tousen)?
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
Hogyoku prophecy and downfall of Central 46?
Date: 2006-03-24 04:18 am (UTC)Or it's not the complete story or it's told in half-truths. It is still possible the Quincy's actions - namely their stubborness - might have brought on the apocalypse as per the "official" explanation seems to dictate. Then again, that's not to say the Soul Society might not have also had other motives for wanting the Quincy exterminated (per our numerous speculations). Unfortunately, with the more I see of Soul Society (and how negligent, incompetent, over-confident and/or corrupt some sectors are), the more likely I think that may be the case.
Hell, we can't be totally sure how much of that "official" explanation (Quincy's obstinance forced the Shinigami into the extermination) is the truth in the first place. All there seems to be is the Shinigami word for it (The Quincy living now may also not have any other version of the story besides the one the Shinigami themselves have been told). It does seem very fishy. Negotiation was *that* impossible? The Shinigami couldn't have lowered the Quincy spiritual powers? I just find it hard to believe there was absolutely no other way besides genocide.
It would not surprise me that Isshin may have had something to do with it.
I kind of see him possibly something like Roy Mustang back then faced with the orders to murder Winry's parents... Isshin, so devastated by his "orders", he could barely deal with it. However, possibly unlike Roy, Isshin may not have been able to go through with his orders, or at least not try to do something to make up for what he did, even if he did go through with them. I do see Isshin as the rebellious type and he may have tried to save some of the Quincy, under the radar of his supervisors.
Also, if Masaki is indeed a Quincy or Quincy-descendant and Isshin likely knew it... he may have married her - apart from being in love with her, I do think he was - to get revenge against Central 46. If he was a Shinigami during the Quincy massacre and strongly opposed that decision... Isshin eventually marrying/procreating with a Quincy, he was doing the very thing his former supervisors feared the most (and they would have no idea at all their worst fear was coming true).
Of course, very hypotethetically speaking here... if there was a prophecy basically stating that the result of combining Quincy/Shinigami powers would eventually lead to the destruction of either Soul Society or Central 46? That prophecy seems to have come true. Central 46 has been destroyed. Except it wasn't actually Ichigo (aka, in theory, the physical result of a Quincy/Shinigami procreation and likely what Central 46 was most afraid of) who destroyed Central 46.... it was Shinigami, Aizen (aided by Gin and Tousen), who wanted the Hogyoku - and total power - for himself. What is the Hogyoku, per our theories? It's a creation of Urahara's that by combining Shinigami and Quincy powers releases Hollow abilities. Which means Central 46's extermination of the Quincy 200 years ago was apparently for nothing.... they *were* destroyed anyway AND due to a Quincy/Shinigami mixing, but *not* the mixing they were expecting.
However, it's also ironic, Aizen made his move on Central 46 upon the advent of Ichigo - the natural Hogyoku (in theory) - invading Soul Society. So, one could say, Ichigo *and* the Hogyoku announced the prophecied downfall of Central 46. Ichigo's appearance distracted the Shinigami and thus gave Aizen the time he needed to finalize his plans in taking the Hogyoku. Aizen wouldn't have been able to do what he did *without* Ichigo (and Rukia meeting Ichigo, thus Urahara gave her that gigai and the embedded Hogyuko inside it, etc etc). Ichigo and the Hogyoku... both the keys to this (hypothetical) prophecy and downfall of Central 46.
Re: Hogyoku prophecy and downfall of Central 46?
Date: 2006-03-25 05:01 pm (UTC)--totally agree.
"Aizen wouldn't have been able to do what he did *without* Ichigo (and Rukia meeting Ichigo, thus Urahara gave her that gigai and the embedded Hogyuko inside it, etc etc). Ichigo and the Hogyoku... both the keys to this (hypothetical) prophecy and downfall of Central 46."
--huh...this is interesting. It still is a bit fuzzy though, how Aizen WAS able to massacre them all. They seem to be a pretty tightly enforced and protected faction of Soul Society.
And, i think Aizen's past, if Kubo decides to give back-story on that, will be so intriguing. NOt to mention, may also tied in some of the other taichos and how they came about and factioned off.
Re: Hogyoku prophecy and downfall of Central 46?
Date: 2006-03-25 05:21 pm (UTC)--totally agree.
"Aizen wouldn't have been able to do what he did *without* Ichigo (and Rukia meeting Ichigo, thus Urahara gave her that gigai and the embedded Hogyuko inside it, etc etc). Ichigo and the Hogyoku... both the keys to this (hypothetical) prophecy and downfall of Central 46."
--huh...this is interesting. It still is a bit fuzzy though, how Aizen WAS able to massacre them all. They seem to be a pretty tightly enforced and protected faction of Soul Society.
And, i think Aizen's past, if Kubo decides to give back-story on that, will be so intriguing. NOt to mention, may also tied in some of the other taichos and how they came about and factioned off.