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[personal profile] retro_eidas
  • I don't have tons to say about the ep, apart from it was basically American Gods but abbreviated into 40 mins and not as good. The whole gods only have power only because humans believe in them thing was there, just not spoken outright. In which case, Kripke trying to be subtle about that particular major theme of American Gods (but kind of failing at it), we can all probably take a good guess how this season is going to end.

  • Rekha Sharma made for a pretty good Kali, even if she wasn't as strong as Lucifer. She was the last god standing when all the predominantly male gods before her were toast, I guess that's something.

  • But yeah, uhm, Ganesha was a vegetarian, Kripke. I doubt he was into the long pig.

  • The guy playing Baldur was a sexy bitch, but didn't seem to have a lot going on upstairs. He seemed to have a dumb or smug grin on his face most of the ep. He'd also been rather bluntly being cuckolded by both Kali and Gabriel.

  • Speaking of Kali/Gabriel, I think I may have more to say on them and it's meaning with regard to Kripke being a Joseph Campbell fanboy, but I think I'll save that for a separate post.

  • Right now, I did find it all rather offensive how very easily the gods were killed and Kali had to be saved by white American males Gabriel, Sam & Dean, but due to the flagrant pilfering from Gaiman (again), I'm going to guess Judeo-Christianity as it's presented in SPN is going to end up much the same in 5x22. Probably with Dean having some Neo-like realization and then wiping the angels out with a thought a la Jesse or convincing Jesse to do it (The hand that rocks the cradle...). Or letting an angel possess him, knowing the truth about all the angels, thus dissolving (or reintegrating) the angel into himself or the world like what Neo did to Agent Smith in "The Matrix". Or whatever.

  • Another possibility, with that tidbit Gabriel gave them in the porn vid re: Lucifer's cage (though I doubt - or perhaps refuse - to believe the solution would be so mundane as just bottling up Lucifer again for an eternity), is Dean himself ends up being the cage and the Horsemen rings are the keys. Dean the one whose supposed to stop it as he's the one who started it blah di blah. Though with that magic power of free will, manages to exert his control over the inner-Michael or Lucifer.

  • I guess I'm also willing to take Lucifer - playing champion for Judeo-Christianity here - plowing through the gods as metaphoric for how Judeo-Christianity gained such a stronghold at strategic times in history. Crushing all opposition and instilling fear and forced subjegation in those that lived on.

  • Lucifer is also basically described like a child having a tantrum, jealous of the "new baby". Likely another anvilly parallel to Dean & Sam (literally between them, but also notably "Jump the Shark" when they first realized the existence of Adam. Whose name sounds even more apropos now than it did then). Gabriel almost directly referring to humanity as the younger siblings that the elder siblings are to take care of. Which Raphael was also alluding to - though as the weary older sibling tired of taking care of the younger (anvilicious Winchester parallels are anvilicious) - in 5x03.

  • However, going back to American Gods, these "elder siblings" would only exist as far as the "younger siblings" willed them. Which could be a sort of sad, but appropriate parallel to how Dean's perceived his existence and place in the family for so long. Dean exists to take care of Sam (and Castiel exists to take care of Dean... and Sam, but mostly Dean. "I gave everything for you!"). Except Sam wills Dean into existence? Probably not literally. I'd think it's more like Sam will likely encourage Dean to have a life for himself. In a more literal sense, Dean, like Jesse, may have the ability to will things (or persons) into being. Like, for example, Castiel (if the American Gods theme holds true, Cas wouldn't be any more real than the angels, thus no more real than than gods in AG). The younger sibling willing the elder to life, metaphorically and literally.

  • Heh, I guess I had more to say than I thought, but I was still pretty meh about it all.

Date: 2010-04-23 06:36 pm (UTC)
amaresu: Sapphire and Steel from the opening (Default)
From: [personal profile] amaresu
I determined years ago that getting annoyed at SPN for fucking up "pagan gods" is just not worth the effort. Scarecrow I got annoyed and pissy. Tall Tales I went, "Wait? No..." and was annoyed, by the time A Very Supernatural Christmas came around I just gave up. I had a brief moment in Mystery Spot where I thought the writers actually got it, but that was apparently a lucky fluke.

The lack of ability to use google, it shows. My Goddess is a Trickster.

I think it's interesting that they haven't said how the rings can be used to lock up Lucifer.

I'm hoping they don't crib too much from American Gods. That would be annoying.

Date: 2010-04-23 06:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] love-jackianto.livejournal.com
'I'm hoping they don't crib too much from American Gods. That would be annoying.'
I wouldn't put it past him. He's 'borrowed' so much from Good Omens that Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman should get co-writer credits by now.

Date: 2010-04-23 06:44 pm (UTC)
amaresu: Sapphire and Steel from the opening (Default)
From: [personal profile] amaresu
Is it really that hard to come up with their own take? Really?

Date: 2010-04-23 07:12 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] love-jackianto.livejournal.com
'Is it really that hard to come up with their own take?'

It seems like it. Personally I think Kripke wanted an Apocalypse storyline, but he didn't really know WHAT to do with it; look at all the stand alone episodes we've had this season where the Apocalypse wasn't even mentioned. I know the show couldn't be all Apocalypse all the time, but a few throw away lines to show the Apocalypse was happening off screen really would have helped.

Date: 2010-04-23 10:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eido.livejournal.com
Though technically a few throw-away lines is what they gave us, but to me, that wasn't near enough tying it all together. Least. Urgent. Apocalypse. Ever. Which has been true most of this season and here we are at ep19 and it's little changed. At this point and after last night (which felt largely like filler ep, the 4th to the last ep of the damn season, apart from Luci's rampage). Basically, if the nukes don't go off in 5x22? As an SPN season it's been okay, but this was probably one of the worst serial apocalypse stories I've ever seen.

Date: 2010-04-23 10:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] love-jackianto.livejournal.com
'Least. Urgent. Apocalypse. Ever.'
Pretty much. Someone on a message board likes to call it Luci's-hobby-that-he'll-get-around-to-sooner-or-later.

'As an SPN season it's been okay, but this was probably one of the worst serial apocalypse stories I've ever seen.'
I know and I had such high hopes for this apocalypse storyline too.

Date: 2010-04-23 10:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eido.livejournal.com
I've noticed there's quite a few similarities to Dean's S4/S5 arc and Kill Bill too.

  • Violated in every which way while he was away (Bride was raped while she was in a coma)

  • Broke out of a buried coffin

  • Special Magic Angel Killing Sword (Hanzo sword)

  • Not Dean specific, but there was vengeance on white trash dude in a trailer home and a tussle with someone fresh from a grave in "Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid" (Death of Budd by Elle and the freshly "resurrected" Beatrix vs. Elle showdown in Budd's trailer home)

  • Sam's S4 revenge obsession (Kill Bill was a revenge story)

  • Kids getting taken by angels: Adam and I'd bet anything, possibly Ben, who will turn out to be Dean's son (Beatrix and BB, BB who'd been alive unbeknownst to Beatrix and stolen away by Bill)

  • Kill Lucifer [and Michael] (Kill Bill)

Date: 2010-04-24 01:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] love-jackianto.livejournal.com
Good points. I love that parallel.

Date: 2010-04-23 09:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eido.livejournal.com
Sad thing is, Kali was the only one of the gods really interesting. Most of the rest of them were just plot devices. Writers, don't introduce Odin, Baldur and Ganesha in the plot unless you have them doing SOMETHING aside from getting killed horribly.

CRACKSPEC: The rings will turn Dean into Sauron TRUFAX

I'm hoping they don't crib too much from American Gods. That would be annoying.

That and they'd probably just keep Castiel unreal, thus erased from existence instead of bringing him back and the purity of the precious Dean/Sam relationship is restored. *yawns*

Date: 2010-04-23 10:14 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] love-jackianto.livejournal.com
'That and they'd probably just keep Castiel unreal, thus erased from existence instead of bringing him back and the purity of the precious Dean/Sam relationship is restored. *yawns*'
Don't say that, you might give the writers ideas. If they do kill off Cas to keep the show JUST about Sam and Dean I'll be so irritated and I'll certainly never get invested in another character if they are there just to be killed.

Date: 2010-04-23 06:38 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] falanyel-86.livejournal.com
Rekha Sharma made for a pretty good Kali, even if she wasn't as strong as Lucifer. She was the last god standing when all the predominantly male gods before her were toast, I guess that's something.

I didn't find her that convincing as THE Hindu Goddess of Death/Destruction. Like you said, I imagined her to be a whole lot stronger, but at least she was pretty and the last one left to face Luci. ;D

when they first realized the existence of Adam. Whose name sounds even more apropos now than it did then)
IKR? Now that I got to think about it... kinda rings a bell. LOL.

To be honest, I'm all confused with the swords now.


Aaaaaand, CAS WAS MISSING!!!! :((

Date: 2010-04-23 10:04 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] eido.livejournal.com
I suppose I'm just grateful I saw Rekha Sharma in something where she wasn't Pure Unsympathetically Evil. *has bad Tori flashbacks from BSG*

Swords = angel's answer to Ruby's Knife/the Colt, at least that's what I got from them. Awesome we went through all this Epic Dean Messiah Story Is Epic.... only to tell us its probably going to end up like like when Dean killed Azazel. Uhm, yay? I'm sort of hoping the Magic Angel Killin Swords are a red herring, but not really clinging to that hope.

IKR!!! Glad to know they've got money to throw away on Misha they can pay him for eps he doesn't appear! >:(

Date: 2010-04-24 04:47 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sailorhathor.livejournal.com
Personally, I think the season *will* end with Lucifer being locked back in his Hell cage, even if it does seem anti-climactic. Joshua said Dean couldn't kill the devil. This is the next best thing, then. Otherwise, we're asking Kripke to be creative enough to imagine what a world without Lucifer would be like, and he can't do that unless he has someone else to rip it off from. ;)

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