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retro_eidasWhile ogling ![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
seablue_eyes's epic Dean/Cas picspam, something dawned on me.
We had not one seductive blonde in a white negligee in FTBYAM, we had two. Chastity and Lucifer!Jessica. Both trying to tempt pure-of-heart heroes to Fall in their own respective ways? Cas facing the temptation of humanity and Sam the temptation of Hell?
Or possibly, Chastity was actually about to morph into a Chester? IDK.
= 
YOU KNOW IT'S TRUE!!
Obviously it's sort of confunded since in SPN it would basically be Aragorn giving Arwen the pendant, but regardless, the pendant is about faith and (God's) love and hope. Dean not wanting Cas to give up on his quest, Arwen wanting Aragorn to persevere and come back to her.
Also pretty dark-haired, blue-eyed ethereal aliens love their mortal, surly world-saviors-to-be. XD
seablue_eyes's epic Dean/Cas picspam, something dawned on me. We had not one seductive blonde in a white negligee in FTBYAM, we had two. Chastity and Lucifer!Jessica. Both trying to tempt pure-of-heart heroes to Fall in their own respective ways? Cas facing the temptation of humanity and Sam the temptation of Hell?
Or possibly, Chastity was actually about to morph into a Chester? IDK.
= YOU KNOW IT'S TRUE!!
Obviously it's sort of confunded since in SPN it would basically be Aragorn giving Arwen the pendant, but regardless, the pendant is about faith and (God's) love and hope. Dean not wanting Cas to give up on his quest, Arwen wanting Aragorn to persevere and come back to her.
Also pretty dark-haired, blue-eyed ethereal aliens love their mortal, surly world-saviors-to-be. XD
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no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 05:37 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 02:21 pm (UTC)You also need to get your ass back here and read the fic
OH GOD I'M SORRY I KEEP DOING THIS.
Date: 2009-09-29 08:32 am (UTC)Dean remembers the last time - the first time - he'd seen it on Castiel. Something had broken loose in him, and it wasn't anger.
Castiel had followed Dean's glance downward, brow furrowing, the process of realisation transparent on his face. (His face.)
"I have offended you," he'd said, not a question. "I apologise," he'd said, his voice tight around the edges, and Dean noticed.
How could he have, then, explained that the answer was more complicated, something that had caught him by surprise? How could he have articulated the warmth that had flooded through him like water, like clear light, at the sight of his talisman resting on Castiel's too-pale skin?
Dean had settled. Reached out to block Castiel's right hand where it was poised to lift the necklace from around his neck - to give back to Dean what Dean had willingly given to him.
Dean had settled for "No. It's fine. It's fine, Cas. Keep it." Keep it, because you're mine just as this is mine.
Dean had used his fingers to slip it back under Castiel's shirt, to tug softly at the seams of fabric and carefully button them together over Castiel's chest.
"When this is - if this - If we somehow, for some completely crazy reason that I can't wrap my brain around right now..." Dean inhales, a noisy shudder that threatens his composure. What little is left of it. "I mean. If I ended up alive and you ended up being okay, too, I know it's just crazy, just hear me out for a second," and he's babbling, and his face is red, and his eyes are beginning to sting, and fuck, this is not supposed to be happening.
"Dean." And that makes him look up, right into Castiel's eyes, and whoever said that thing about windows to the soul had to be right because he feels pierced, like all that Cas is has been concentrated into those two points of unearthly blue.
"I would not leave you," says Castiel. "Rather one lifetime by your side than eternity in Paradise."
And Dean knows. Knows it should make him a fucking selfish monster, to so obscenely make Cas give and give and fucking give. Knows he should hate himself a little more with every quiet, certain breath that seals this... this promise.
"Cas, you can't. You can't."
But the weight of the pendant is solid, real, in the centre of Dean's palm, and Castiel is already folding his fingers around it.
When Castiel leans to kiss the knuckles of his trembling hand, Dean understands what faith means.
--
Re: OH GOD I'M SORRY I KEEP DOING THIS.
Date: 2009-09-29 02:16 pm (UTC)"I would not leave you," says Castiel. "Rather one lifetime by your side than eternity in Paradise."
And Dean knows. Knows it should make him a fucking selfish monster, to so obscenely make Cas give and give and fucking give. Knows he should hate himself a little more with every quiet, certain breath that seals this... this promise.
[...]
When Castiel leans to kiss the knuckles of his trembling hand, Dean understands what faith means.
Oh God. I'm going to be wibbling at work now.
The pendant has so much gravitas to it. I feel they were even trying to downplay it somewhat in FTBYAM (as I do think it was a rather fine edge there between fan-baiting and canon), but without actually saying the words, Dean has essentially gifted Cas the pendant so Cas won't lose his faith. It's Cas' faith in God, but for Dean, it's his faith in Cas, which seems to be stronger than ever. The necklace, that faith, reluctantly given at first, but now given freely. That Impala scene strongly mirrored Dean's God pep talk to Sam in the Impala in ITGPSW, Sam who we know Dean loves dearly. Now Cas gets the same damn talk and magical boon with it. Yes, it's the God EMF and Cas needs it for his quest, but the symbolism behind it? I just... I can't even. I realize it could easily be like the Holy Grail or Excalibur when it comes to boons, but it's show that keeps bringing up the LOTR! They've got to expect at least some of us are going to make the Evenstar connection. lol
Re: OH GOD I'M SORRY I KEEP DOING THIS.
Date: 2009-09-29 02:24 pm (UTC)Everything you say (the gravitas - absolutely, and in hindsight after the car conversation in 5.03 it just increases), and then this:
but it's show that keeps bringing up the LOTR!
There was an explicit one in the very same episode, too. Oh SHOW.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 02:50 pm (UTC)Believe it or not and despite the above, I think I missed the one in 5.03 and I can't rewatch it now to look for it. Where was it?
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 02:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 03:31 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 04:16 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 04:22 pm (UTC)I was talking to someone who is pretty sure Anna will take our wee baby-blue-eyed Castiel's virginity. Now that's some cloudseeding. But I think I would find it unforgiveable, to be quite honest. Spn is good at having its cake and eating it, too, and after all it makes sense for Castiel to turn to someone who has been in a very similar place experientially. But I just have to think of two scenes which seemed to be Dean/Anna but they are oh so so so so VERY Dean/Cas that I wish I could ask the actors if they had any idea that it was a strong possible reading, because I would sooner admit I'm clinically insane than say that I misread the scenes. (I'm thinking of Anna touching the handprint, and of Castiel's expression when Anna kisses Dean.)
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 05:09 pm (UTC)I wouldn't be shocked this happened, but I'm sort of apprehensive about it if for any reason my own paranoid, fatalistic thoughts re: Anna's return. Although I don't know if I can be really blamed for that paranoia when I can't stop thinking about what Castiel was like when he came back from getting forcibly dragged back to Heaven. Even if Anna should come back more or less herself, I'd still be apprehensive. I couldn't be certain what we were seeing was genuine or something scarily Manchurian Candidate-like as a result of Bible boot camp. To the right (or wrong) people, Anna would certainly be an asset when it comes to the elusive Winchesters and their circle of trust. I'd have a hard time imagining, the conniver and operator we're to believe Zachariah is, not having noticed or taken advantage of that.
So, I could see Cas/Anna possibly happening, but instead of being a throwback to Dean/Anna, it's more on the lines of Sam/Ruby. It's unnerving, but I do think the possibility is there.
I just have to think of two scenes which seemed to be Dean/Anna but they are oh so so so so VERY Dean/Cas that I wish I could ask the actors if they had any idea that it was a strong possible reading
If it wasn't then - and if you're insane I'm right there with you because I'm hard pressed considering many other interpretations - I'd seriously have to wonder about now. Dean/Anna's Epic Fleeting Love "Titanic"-style which was founded largely by their angsty daddy issues? Hello, "missing fathers"? Cas in FTBYAM was essentially taking up Dean's role in H&H, both having a deep trauma and sadness (Dean due to Hell and Cas, having "lost everything", on top of the serious blow his faith just took) with (FTBYAM)Dean in Anna's role as the balm (and here I go back thinking about what all that amulet means).
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 05:36 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 06:10 pm (UTC)That's exactly what it looks like.
Re: OH GOD I'M SORRY I KEEP DOING THIS.
Date: 2009-09-29 04:59 pm (UTC)Re: OH GOD I'M SORRY I KEEP DOING THIS.
Date: 2009-09-29 08:26 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 03:20 pm (UTC)ETA: Oh and er, I saw this post via deancastiel's flist. Hi!
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 04:24 pm (UTC)If future!Cas tries to give the amulet back to present!Dean and present!Dean, after seeing his hopelessness, tells him to keep it. That would so rock my world.
God.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 05:05 pm (UTC)I'm not one to expect continuity in canon (hello, SV survivor here, kinda new to SPN) but the show did it with the cellphone (5x2-4), amulet (5x2-3 so far), and rib sigils (5x1-2). Every time stuff that happened in prior episodes get acknowledged, I must admit to some surprise. Forgive me if my imagination runs away with me. :D
Anyway, yeah, even if the show doesn't oblige me this one measly scene, there's always fic for that.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 05:28 pm (UTC)It's perfect set-up really. However, there's also the possibility of Cas losing it or Dean throwing it in a river or something, which would also be symbolic, if in a totally tragic way. Though I'd most definitely prefer your scenario. Despite all the doped up stupor, I'd rather think Cas would have never lost that amulet. But where my mind is regarding 5.04, specifically Cas, is Eliot's "The Waste Land". Which is clearly one big barrel of fun. :| I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
What I think is most intriguing about the looks of 5.04 is that Castiel seems to have essentially become Dean, but almost more like this caricature of Dean. Like if those aliens in Star Trek:TOS's Piece of the Action had remade Dean, he'd be like future!Cas. Pot-smoking and orgies? That's indulgent, hedonistic Dean cranked to 11. The thing about that side of Dean, though not necessarily fake, I do think it's largely a mask he wears either to cope or keep people at a distance. I wouldn't be shocked this whole persona of Castiel's is equally a means to cope, not let people see how really damaged he is inside. Obvs, it's risky getting too deeply into the spoiler-spec, but I'd almost want to say the more elaborate the persona - and future!Cas' looks mighty elaborate - the deeper the damage. Not unlike Dean plastered a smile on his face through too much of S3 as he faced down death and Hell. It would be understandable, though heart-rending, Cas may be literally suicidal, but the only thing keeping him together may very well be Dean (perhaps the last thing Cas still has faith in? However, if something should happen and he were to lose that faith...?). Despite how different Dean himself seems to be.
While Dean has become the scary, serious All Business supersoldier. We're just going on snip-its of info now obviously, but I'd say he could be something like a certain surly angel that got stabbed in the neck back in OTHOAP. Castiel was his partner too.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 06:12 pm (UTC)Despite all the doped up stupor, I'd rather think Cas would have never lost that amulet
Yeah, if future!Cas kept it safe after the past 5 years despite all his hedonism, showing the amulet could quickly signify to the audience and sort of reassure present!Dean that there's still enough present!Cas in there. Of course, I fully expect them to quickly undercut that by having future!Cas try to give it back--a case of 'show, don't tell' that he's done with his God-hunt.
It would be understandable, though heart-rending, Cas may be literally suicidal, but the only thing keeping him together may very well be Dean (perhaps the last thing Cas still has faith in? However, if something should happen and he were to lose that faith...?). Despite how different Dean himself seems to be.
Well, in the scenario I've built up in my head, Cas sorta kinda still has faith in supersoldier!Dean--he's gunnin' zombies around side by side with him at least. But then present!Dean shows up and he and future!Cas get close; future!Cas admits to himself how far gone the other Dean is, stops kidding himself, gives up, tries to give amulet back to present!Dean, present!Dean declines, tries to reassure him. Then future!Cas dies. \o/ Mwahaha!
But, um, yeah. I don't really have much of an idea what future!Dean would be like to be around. Do you think he'll act like Cas is his subordinate or anything like that? I hope not but that's what keeps popping up in my head. *makes face*
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 10:58 pm (UTC)If we're going to be angsty about it, if future!Cas should die, I'd really want present!Dean to find the amulet in his pocket or around his neck. Just the idea of Dean knowing he kept it the whole time is the crucial factor to me if the amulet is still around. That, even through a horrifying situation and in death, Cas never really lost faith (in God or in Dean). No matter his actions, future!Dean's demeanor or whatever Cas says in the ep.
Then future!Cas dies. \o/ Mwahaha!
I love how in both of our scenarios, Cas dying is pretty much the requirement. XD Someone has got to be dying though really. It seems prerequisite for SPN time-travel stories! It's also going to be lame if this supremely dangerous post-apocalyptic situation isn't killing some folks (I still suspect Ben Edlund is going to give us a Hamlet ending). Ma and Pa Campbell died in ITB. Bobby died and Dean died a million times in Mystery Spot.
Slightly random, but I've been wondering about the familial / generational motife too. In ITB (the past), it was the Campbells. Present it's the Winchesters. Future... who else would it be but Dean and Castiel (and technically Sam, I suppose)? So, we have at least one future that seems to suggest, Winchesters plus one is the familial unit. That plus one that just so happens to be all Dean's. ;) I guess that makes Cas Dean's Katherine Brewster. lol
Do you think he'll act like Cas is his subordinate or anything like that?
That is kind of what I'm expecting, unfortunately. It makes sense considering what Dean is apparently supposed to be like in the future.
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 08:27 pm (UTC)*falls to floor*
no subject
Date: 2009-09-29 11:04 pm (UTC)MIGHTY LOTR WIZARD GODERU ILUVATAR WITH ALL THE TRUTHINESS!!